RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Discussion on faith*

Logged in as: Guest

RE: So what do you believe? A thinking Mans/Womans Discussion on faith

All Forums >> [Non-Gaming] >> Members’ Chat Zone >> RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Discussion on faith*

Page: << < prev 1 2 3 [4] 5 next > >>

Message

<< Older Topic Newer Topic >>

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Sep.-27th-2007 6:00:52

The Corrupt

Posts: 495
Joined: Sep.-24th-2007
From: Sunny 'ole England! ;D
Status: offline

So now deaf and blind people are mere tools?

You call all of those "miracles" acts of God. I call them great work on the part of the doctors who actually cared for that person for however many days or weeks before they recovered. Sorry, but when a Doctor has been beside someone for weeks on end, helping them survive, there is little fact pointing towards "OMG! GOD MUST HAVE DONE IT!".

Make sure you read what you give me, okay?

For the first link, her reason for survival was obvious - "We were able, over a 48-hour period, to cover her whole body with an artificial skin replacement that allowed this to start healing rapidly. Within about a week her skin was back." How did your god have a hand in that? They called it a miraculous recovery because she recovered quicker than expected - she would have lived, no matter what. Just because she healed a little faster doesn't exactly disprove my point.

Your second and third links mostly consist of websites commenting on the above case, or similar cases where Doctors saved the person's life through some "miraculous" twist of fate, so there's little point in bothering with that.

And as a note for next time, Will, don't assume that there is only one definition of respect. There's nothing illegal about me having little tolerance for people who prefer to trust their lives in a 2000-or-so year old book, is there? It also seems that you should rethink your idea on the use of the word "miraculous". It is a word commonly used when something happens that isn't expected - it's not an insta-"god cares" sign.

That's all I really have to say on the matter because, quite simply, you seem to follow the following quote quite well...

"It is possible that a confusion between the different meanings of respect affects the attitudes of people and organizations. For example, freedom of religion implies that we must respect the right of anyone to believe whatever they wish, to act within the law in accordance with their beliefs, and not to be discriminated against on account of their beliefs. However, the use of the word respect seems to have shifted our attitudes towards the quite different notion that we must behave respectfully towards their beliefs, and not criticise them. This is a restriction on freedom of speech, and is inherently hypocritical—anyone with any view on religion must necessarily believe that those who believe differently are deluded, although their rights must be respected."

Anyway, there really is little point in carrying this on. I despise the very thought of a god existing simply because he wasn't there when my sister needed him most... You evidently prefer to believe that anything extraordinary that man does is instantly attributed to your god.

_____________________________

"Death is the only certainty in life, remember? They're going to die, and I'm going to laugh over their corpses..." ~ Alfie

(in reply to WilliamRLBaker)

Post #: 61

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Sep.-27th-2007 6:58:48

ShiftyLookingCow

Posts: 253
Joined: May-14th-2007
Status: offline

here is the christian answer as far as I once knew:
Problem: God created the universe and everything and put mankind at the top. Man chooses to rebel knowingly. So he is cursed with death. Spiritual death: His and his every child's seperation from God causes mankind to be imperfect(doing something against God) and capable of any kind of evil given enough bad choices and time. Physical Death: everybody will die, either because of disease/natural disasters or because of age. As you know death seals your relationship with God, hell or heaven.
Now the solution: Jesus came to die in place of people who believe so that they brought back to God(he comes to back to life because he is only one pure and he is God's Son), and even though they die, they are brought back to life later. Also it says he will change the corrupted world we live back how it once was and more. All this was according to the bible was made sure by him on the cross, and his sacrifice being accepted by Father.

Ok sorry if my explanation sucked, I am not a christian(I thought I was one) so my explanation is not going to be good. Anyways getting back: Even though I dont like its end results(like my grandparents went to hell ie they didnt believe and they are dead, my parents most likely, tons of others, a lot of people who suffer now seem to go to hell) and forgetting any scientific discrepancies, the christian answer seems to explain the world as we percieve to a considerable extent(at least as far as daily life goes). But here comes the main problem: why would God allow the Fall(man disobeying) to ever happen knowing it will certainly damn many(and make them evil, bring all the physical suffering and so on) if not most people who ever existed? The only answer that makes sense logically: humanity is secondary, like a tool. That from a human perspective(of course I am talking for most people, people going to hell) is very unsatisfactory.

Right now I feel like deleting this but I am not going to, you mentioning about "why God wasnt there when he was needed" just reminded me part of the reason why I am not a believer. I will probably remain agnostic till I die.

_____________________________

Hi, my name is Achilles and my email is shoot@myheel.com and I am the webmaster of www.freedeadhectorporn.com.

(in reply to The Corrupt)

Post #: 62

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Sep.-27th-2007 14:08:12

WilliamRLBaker

Posts: 1230
Joined: Apr.-21th-2007
Status: offline

I'll say this once and only once in reply to that lil bit of tripe you gave looney. YOUR NOT THE ONLY PERSON that has lost someone, so dont act all high and mighty cause you have and like you have all the answers.

And respect? respect means Dont go calling people that believe in god idiots, Dont go and call god a lazy ass like you did.

AS for that Looney, here in this thread, THERE IS ONLY ONE MEANING FOR RESPECT and thats dont be an ass to people that believe, which you have done so far. so I kindly ask you to leave this thread before you make it get locked because of your purely disrespectful attitude.

P.S: maybe in your world you cannot respect any one that has an differing opinion then your own, but in mine? I can, as long as they dont try to force feed me there opinion and as long as they respect mine back.

(in reply to The Corrupt)

Post #: 63

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Sep.-27th-2007 15:59:44

HeavyRaines17

Posts: 1800
Joined: Sep.-17th-2007
From: Late-night infomercials
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: WilliamRLBaker

I'll say this once and only once in reply to that lil bit of tripe you gave looney. YOUR NOT THE ONLY PERSON that has lost someone, so dont act all high and mighty cause you have and like you have all the answers.

And respect? respect means Dont go calling people that believe in god idiots, Dont go and call god a lazy ass like you did.

AS for that Looney, here in this thread, THERE IS ONLY ONE MEANING FOR RESPECT and thats dont be an ass to people that believe, which you have done so far. so I kindly ask you to leave this thread before you make it get locked because of your purely disrespectful attitude.

P.S: maybe in your world you cannot respect any one that has an differing opinion then your own, but in mine? I can, as long as they dont try to force feed me there opinion and as long as they respect mine back.

Bro, you need to chill. Of all of the replies in this entire thread, YOURS are the ones that are the least respectful. You were rude to me when I was completely respectful and now you are being rude to someone else because they are justifying and clarifying their position. That's why I think that this thread should be locked/closed; because the creator of this thread is not following his own rules.

_____________________________

--There's always money in the banana stand--

(in reply to WilliamRLBaker)

Post #: 64

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Sep.-27th-2007 17:42:56

WilliamRLBaker

Posts: 1230
Joined: Apr.-21th-2007
Status: offline

whatever you say man
lets go over the replies.

between you and me
from your first post
""There's a little bit of ignorance flying out there but not nearly as bad as it could be. ""

what ignorance? I saw no ignorance before you so boldly came in and said that ignorance was flying around.

my reply
""@heavyraines the ignorance comment please leave that out next time, AS for that Ignorance is only something unlearned unwilling to be learned.

No one is ignorant unless they refuse to learn more, That is the true ignorance, so any such comments in this thread that you find to be remember that, Just because a person doesn't know a thing doesn't mean they dont wish too, Its only untill they decide they dont want too is when they become ignorant.""

saying dont come in and so boldy claim that ignorance is flying around regardless of the scale, All so giving my own relfection on what ignorance is, Did I disrespect you and say shut the hell up and dont say there is ignorance? i asked you nicely not to come in and just make a bold claim.

your next reply
""The ignorance comment was not directed to you in any way, it was directed to those who decided to justify their beliefs by bashing other people's.""

Not only had no one come into the thread and bashed other peoples beliefs to justify their own, I never said it was directed at me, I said it to keep such words as ignorance, stupid, idiot...ect out of the thread.

next reply mine
""We'lll I still stand by my statement because i saw no one bashing other peoples faith in the thread, Beyond the ignorance comment, So i see no point in using the ignorance comment.""

No one before your comment of ignoance flying around in the thread, had any one bashed, or showed ignorance by your defition.
I am not the person in this thread whom is giving one lines, and none thoughtout posts aimed simply at making statements aimed at only one path and thats conversion...like some in the thread.

And looney used the word idiot to describe people that believe in god.

So last time I checked I was the one trying to maintain the peace and when someone clearly wasn't interested in being respectful to other peoples faiths and describing them as idiots...then i asked them to leave.

P.S:
you contradict your self.

"" Bro, you need to chill. Of all of the replies in this entire thread, YOURS are the ones that are the least respectful.""

""
The ignorance comment was not directed to you in any way, it was directed to those who decided to justify their beliefs by bashing other people's. You, on the other hand, seem to have a very firm grip on your beliefs""
So im not bashing people, im not ignorant, i have a firm grip on my beliefs...yet now you say of all the posts in the thread mine are the most disrespectful?

< Message edited by WilliamRLBaker -- Sep.-27th-2007 17:43:56 >

(in reply to HeavyRaines17)

Post #: 65

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Sep.-27th-2007 17:43:59

zerofunction

Posts: 1581
Joined: Mar.-22th-2007
Status: offline

Back on topic.

_____________________________

(in reply to WilliamRLBaker)

Post #: 66

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Sep.-27th-2007 17:48:12

WilliamRLBaker

Posts: 1230
Joined: Apr.-21th-2007
Status: offline

dont worry bout it zero im not taking part any more....I've lost all mood to talk about religion in this place...
so mods do what you will keep it alive..whatever

I'm off to bed.

(in reply to zerofunction)

Post #: 67

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Sep.-27th-2007 20:10:16

The Corrupt

Posts: 495
Joined: Sep.-24th-2007
From: Sunny 'ole England! ;D
Status: offline

Right, Will...

You sat there, watching the Doctors whisper to your parents that your sisters heart is so fucked up that she won't live past 7... You sat there, each and every ****** night, doing as you were always told to - praying that that guy upstairs would fix her. Would save her. You sat there the day she died, holding her hand as her heart finally gave in... You sat there, at the funeral, knowing that the only bastard in the universe who could have saved her didn't. I never said that I was the only person to lose someone. But here I am being told that your god exists, the very man I asked help from. He didn't save her. It was the only time I had ever prayed to ask for something, and even that wasn't enough.

</rant>

Anyway... Back on topic...

I actually think god is just a tool, a device if you want. A way for humanity to cope with the extraordinary that hasn't been explained yet and a device that makes us less afraid of death. Whether he exists or not is ironically irrelevant, because the idea will never diminish... So it doesn't matter if he exists or not, because he will as long as people maintain their belief in him...

_____________________________

"Death is the only certainty in life, remember? They're going to die, and I'm going to laugh over their corpses..." ~ Alfie

(in reply to WilliamRLBaker)

Post #: 68

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Sep.-27th-2007 20:15:24

zerofunction

Posts: 1581
Joined: Mar.-22th-2007
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: WilliamRLBaker

The title says it all and i hope the mods pay attention, THIS IS AN RELIGION THREAD.

Such a concept, A ideal, A topic persay is sure to incite passions so....Heres the deal this is a thinking mans/womans religion/faith discussion a few ground rules must be set.

Beyond your first post and stateing what you believe, what your denomination is. your posts must be well thought out and be none forum fodder, because they will often be in reply to someone else, either asking questions or making a statement.
1.one linders.
2.singular posts of one word.
3.no dissing other peoples beliefs or religions, If you dont agree then simply say i dont agree and give your reason but dont demean and belittle others beliefs, Not agreeing is fine and giveing your reasons is fine, but have some tact.
Edit: 4.if you are currently taking part or wish to take part, and you are having a hard time with whats being said, passions rising, anger...ect do not comment give your self time, If you read something you dont like sit back close your eyes and take it in, Words in anger are never good and never thought out right, so give your self time before you answer or post.

I'll start.
I was baptized lutheran but rarely go to church, and I rarely agree with the lutheran way of things, Therefor I do not believe in the lutheran,catholic, whatever way, I don't agree with most any religion on this planet atleast I dont agree in total. I agree with parts of the different ideals on the planet.
I am all so of a naturalist and scientific mind, I believe in evolution and the natural course of life in the universe, I believe that god started this and such details? best not to go into them because it would be way too big of a post for that.

I am not agnostic, Athiest...ect I do believe in god but in a very none general way. I think thats the best way to start.

*remember no demeaning of others faiths regardless of your thougths on them, no matter how offensive those faiths might well be, if you dont feel comfortable in talking bout them in a discussion then dont take part in that part of the thread*

Seems like a few of you cant grasp what mature conversation means. So heres a reminder of what the topic is about. I advise you to read before continuing this discussion.

_____________________________

(in reply to WilliamRLBaker)

Post #: 69

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Sep.-28th-2007 9:31:00

Poisen

Posts: 1574
Joined: Aug.-22th-2007
Status: offline

Is God Willing to Prevent Evil But Not Able?
-Then he is not Omnipotent.
Is he able but not willing?
-Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing?
-Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing?
-Then why call him God.

(in reply to zerofunction)

Post #: 70

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Jun.-10th-2008 11:35:58

harry190

Posts: 3600
Joined: Feb.-10th-2008
From: Why do you want to know you BIG pervert
Status: offline

I believe in Aliens,do you?

_____________________________

I am your father and your mother.

(in reply to Poisen)

Post #: 71

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Jun.-10th-2008 11:40:33

SpaceCowgirl

Posts: 3476
Joined: Jul.-19th-2007
From: Andromeda
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: harry190

I believe in Aliens,do you?

XENU IS GONNA GIT YA!

_____________________________

(in reply to harry190)

Post #: 72

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Jun.-10th-2008 11:42:56

MrSwede

Posts: 2801
Joined: Jun.-25th-2007
From: Sweden?
Status: offline

He bumped it!!!

Cool.

_____________________________

(in reply to SpaceCowgirl)

Post #: 73

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Jun.-10th-2008 11:43:29

zonetrooper5

Posts: 2450
Joined: Mar.-23th-2007
From: England
Status: online

I personally wish that there was never any such thing as religion. For me, I sort of think that religion is a false hope for people to comfort them from say death, the afterlife and more.

_____________________________

(in reply to snoop_dizzle)

Post #: 74

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Jun.-10th-2008 11:44:57

Shmammy

Posts: 1532
Joined: Mar.-10th-2008
From: Phoenix, AZ
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: zonetrooper5

I personally wish that there was never any such thing as religion. For me, I sort of think that religion is a false hope for people to comfort them from say death, the afterlife and more.

Wow....I couldn't agree with you more!

(in reply to zonetrooper5)

Post #: 75

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Jun.-10th-2008 11:45:21

SpaceCowgirl

Posts: 3476
Joined: Jul.-19th-2007
From: Andromeda
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: zonetrooper5

I personally wish that there was never any such thing as religion. For me, I sort of think that religion is a false hope for people to comfort them from say death, the afterlife and more.

Also works well to keep psychopaths from giving into their indulgences and killing every person that crosses their path.

_____________________________

(in reply to zonetrooper5)

Post #: 76

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Jun.-10th-2008 11:54:03

harry190

Posts: 3600
Joined: Feb.-10th-2008
From: Why do you want to know you BIG pervert
Status: offline

Ok.Someone elaborate on secularization and conformism now.
After that,we shall proceed to a discussion on the bureaucratization
of faith,clear things up on evolution and tackle science's new found iron grip on
the plebeians.

The agenda is set.

PS:I knew it would happen.I am irresistible after all.

RuJoshin ain't gonna git me.

< Message edited by harry190 -- Jun.-10th-2008 12:02:20 >

_____________________________

I am your father and your mother.

(in reply to SpaceCowgirl)

Post #: 77

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Jun.-10th-2008 12:05:11

MrSwede

Posts: 2801
Joined: Jun.-25th-2007
From: Sweden?
Status: offline

I read HeavyRaines first post in this thread just to see what he wrote (don't ask me why I picked him

) and I must say I feel the same way he does on the matter. Who knows, my views might change as life goes on, but I've had the same thoughts on religion as long as I can remember.

_____________________________

(in reply to harry190)

Post #: 78

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Jun.-10th-2008 12:08:45

HeavyRaines17

Posts: 1800
Joined: Sep.-17th-2007
From: Late-night infomercials
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: MrSwede

I read HeavyRaines first post in this thread just to see what he wrote (don't ask me why I picked him) and I must say I feel the same way he does on the matter. Who knows, my views might change as life goes on, but I've had the same thoughts on religion as long as I can remember.

What did I say again? Am I a witch-doctor?

_____________________________

--There's always money in the banana stand--

(in reply to MrSwede)

Post #: 79

RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Dis... - Jun.-10th-2008 12:09:48

KEVERS

Posts: 4086
Joined: Apr.-29th-2008
From: Newfoundland Canada
Status: offline

heres my take on relegion,

I think its a primative superstition. In the present we can go into space, split atoms and clone life....yet we still believe an invisible man. When an Amazon tribe fears thunder because they think its a pissed off god, we say "oh, silly them, they're so primative they don't know any better"....then we go and fold our hands and talk to Mr. Invisible. I think relegion is a cash cow for people who know how to use it to their advantage. People will willingly fork over their money and even lives without a second thought in the name of relegion. Its a powerful tool to certain people which I feel is holding us back as free willed individuals. Its pumped into your brain from day one, from your parents, churches and schools....but if you grew up in a room by yourself with no outside contact, would you find god on your own? No, you would laugh at the idea of such a notion.
This is my personal opionion and I do not want to offend anyone and I'm not forcing my beliefs on you. I have respect for others peoples beliefs because they are important to the person, thats all.

PS: if your really pissed about this....Heavyraines made me do it

_____________________________

Cast Your Votes. Voting For Yourself is Lame
http://forums.n4g.com/m_216296/mpage_1/key_/tm.htm#216296
0!!!!

(in reply to harry190)

Post #: 80

Page: << < prev 1 2 3 [4] 5 next > >>

All Forums >> [Non-Gaming] >> Members’ Chat Zone >> RE: So what do you believe? *A thinking Mans/Womans Discussion on faith*

Page: << < prev 1 2 3 [4] 5 next > >>

Jump to:

New Messages	No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages	Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages	Locked w/o New Messages

Post New Thread

Reply to Message

Post New Poll

Submit Vote

Delete My Own Post

Delete My Own Thread

Rate Posts